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    ----- Original Message -----
From: alexglaros
To: Otto Dietrich
Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 10:59 AM
Subject: screen serve

Hey Otto,

I have a rules question.

I am a righty serving in singles and am standing against the far left wall.

I serve a hard drive straight down the left side of the court, 15 inches to the right of my body.

I and the ball are both on the left side of the court, and the ball is to the right of me.

My opponent is standing in the back middle of the court.

He can of course see the ball at every stage of the serve since at no point does my body obscure the ball.

Because the ball was close to my body, the ref called the serve a screen.

I think he is confused because the ball did not cross my body.

The purpose of the serve is to jam the opponent by hitting it at him to jam him or on his left hand side where he is not expecting it.

What is the call?

Could it EVER be considererd a screen if my body motions never obscure the ball?

Thanks,

Alex


from Otto Dietrich to alexglaros@ date Sat, Mar 8, 2008 at 8:16 PM
subject Re: screen serve

Hi Alex

That serve you described is NOT a screen because, as you stated, it was fully visible throughout its entire flight from your racquet to the front wall and to the back court.

If your opponent (or the ref) claimed that it was a screen because there was impairment associated with it, then I'd suggest that the impairment was the more result of having been fooled than it was due to the closeness of the serve passing near you.

Hope that answers your question.

At your service,

Otto

OTTO E. DIETRICH
National Rules Commissioner
USA Racquetball
"Play by the Rules" http://usra.org/Rulebook.aspx


Subject:              Re: Drive Serves

        Date:              Fri, 10 Mar 2000 01:57:40 GMT

       From:              "Otto Dietrich" 

 Newsgroups:              alt.sport.racquetball





Hey Fred



You got this one wrong.  A screen can occur on a z-serve especially one that

crosses IN FRONT OF (rather than behind) the server's body.  Jimmy Lowe, for

one example is fond of that type of serve.



Otto



OTTO E. DIETRICH

President, United States Racquetball Association 1998-Present

National Rules Commissioner 1988-1998

Member of National Rules Committee 1982-Present



"Fred Welfare"  wrote in message



> As I recall, a screen serve cannot occur on anything other than a drive

serve.

> If a Z-serve is not a drive, then can there be a screen?  Is it possible

to

> screen a lob or half lob or half Z-serve?

>

>

>

>

>

> It's in my heart.

>  Frederick Welfare

>

>






Subject: Re: Frequently Asked Questions Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 18:37:00 -0500 From: "Kevin Young" Hi John, I'll try and address your comments. The first being reading the FAQ. Well I'm glad that you enjoyed it. As with other FAQ's for other newsgroups, it is asked that newbies read the FAQ before posting. I've never made an issue of this as most people won't read it anyway, and everytime one person asks a question however basic, many will learn from the answer. The racquetball FAQ is a work in progress constantly evolving as the sport changes. The FAQ was originated by Tom Arneberg. He had it on his site for several years until Jeff Anthony took it over. Jeff updated it with the help of others and maintained it for a couple of years. I took it over in early December and am updating it more with the help of others. I don't usually get involved with rule questions as other here are very good at it like John Varrill and Otto. But a quick example of when it would not be a hinder when you hit your opponent would be when your shot would not have had enough velocity or proper direction to hit the front wall anyway. As far as intentionally hitting your opponent goes, don't do it. But we've all heard of occasions when it does happen and perhaps the most common event is when someone is repeatedly in your way and you finally do not hold up. You ask if it is always the opponents responsibility to get out of the way and the answer is yes, IF he is either blocking a shot straight back into the front wall or a cross court pass. The rules give the shooter these two shots and you have to get out of the way for them. Any other shot is not a given and you can't be called for being in the way. Good questions. And the only poor ones are the ones that are never asked. My best, -- -Kevin Young- Team E-Force http://surf.to/Racquetball_Links http://welcome.to/Racquetball.FAQ http://www.fortunecity.com/olympia/dimaggio/919/ ) "John D." wrote in message > Kevin, > > I just read the FAQ! This is the best thing since sliced bread! Being a > newcomer to the group it's not my place to implement policy but I would > think some of the "elders" would *require* newbies to read the FAQ when > first posting questions and then help explain items that are confusing or > not covered. For example, is it ever *not* a hinder when you hit your > opponent with the ball? What if you hit your opponent intentionally? I don't > know why you would but I guess it could happen... Is it always the > opponent's responsibility to get out of the way? What's the call? > > John D. > > "Kevin Young" wrote in message > > The "redirect" is currently not working on the FAQ for this newsgroup. > You > > can still access the "Frequently Asked Questions" by using it's real > > address. > > http://www.fortunecity.com/olympia/dimaggio/919/ > > > > Sorry for the inconvenience. > > > > > > -- > > -Kevin Young- > > Team E-Force > > http://surf.to/Racquetball_Links > > http://welcome.to/Racquetball.FAQ > > > > > >
Subject: Re: Screen? Date: 22 Feb 2000 07:33:40 GMT From: (Jordan Kahn) Bob, I will take a wild guess and say that you have not played many doubles tournaments? Anyone can be screened in certain situations, regardless of singles or doubles. You described a "text-book" example of what could be a screen. Remember that it is only a screen if there was a chance for the player to return the ball. When the hitter and opponent are close to the front wall, there is less field of vision, thus more chances for a screen to be called. The critical reasoning to answer your question is, could your opponent return your shot if you were not standing there? If your opponent had a "chance", then yes it is a screen, hinder or even a possible avoidable hinder on you if you prevented them from having a chance to hit your shot. Screens and hinders are just part of playing doubles. Start getting use to it if you want to continue playing in tournaments, otherwise it will drive you crazy. Good luck, Jordan ---- Bob Coslow wrote> Playing in a non-ref'd (c) doubles consolation match this weekend my opponent called a screen on the following setup. The opposing team hit a shot which came high off the back wall and ended way up front, I waited for it, took an easy pinch kill to the front right corner. One of my opponents was positioned behind and slightly to my left, said he couldn't see the ball and asked for a screen. I've never had a person call a screen in doubles
Subject: Re: Another Serve Question Date: 22 Jun 2000 12:37:04 GMT From: (Jordan Kahn) Larry, that is one of the most asked questions, but also has several answers. The rule doesn't say anything about the receiver being able to see the ball on a serve before it is hit, while it is being hit, or on the way to the front wall. In fact, a good server will hide the serve to make it tougher for the receiver to tell where the ball is going. This is legal and good strategy. With that said, here is the "Screen Serve" rule and I will explain… "Rule 3.9 FAULT SERVES", Rule (h) Screen Serves. A served ball that first hits the front wall and on the rebound passes so closely to the server, or server's partner in doubles, that it prevents the receiver from having a clear view of the ball." The rest you mentioned, about the receiver being obligated to position in center court. There is no mention of "10 or 18" inch rule. This is because it is difficult to tell on some shots how close they are. Unless you happen to carry a ruler while you play. Most "Z" serves will never be a screen serve and any serve that bounces to the backwall-sidewall corners direct from the front wall will NEVER be a screen serve if the server did not cross into the 3-foot drive serve lane. It has more to do with where the ball is headed and where the server ended up as the ball past the server coming OFF THE FRONT WALL. Some servers just have real good serves, and some receivers are not use to it. On the otherhand, many servers forget to watch their serve and move out of the way, ending up "blocking" or screening the serve without knowing it. Remember, where eyeguards and ALWAYS watch the ball! This is a perfect example of how a camcorder can be used for all players to review and learn. Good Luck, Jordan PS. Try to stop by and watch (or play) at a USRA local sanction tournament. You will be able to have qualified people show and explain this. -- Subject: Another Serve Question From: larry Date: 6/22/00 6:47 AM Central Daylight Time I just started in a league at a new club. The question is: If you are the receiver in "good" court receiving position, are you entitled to see the ball hit the front wall? My opponent (and the club pro) tell me that as long as the ball passes no less than 10 inches (maybe 12?) from the server, it's a good serve. On a few occasions, the only view I got of the ball was when it passed the server's body after it hit the front wall. I never saw it at all before then. I have played in only one other club regularly, and at that club, if you couldn't see the ball hit the front wall because the server's body was obstructing your vision, it was considered a fault serve. I dunno. I can play either way, of course; but I think that is only fair if you can see the ball at the front wall in order to get the time needed to return that serve. If the server has a pretty good (fast) serve, I'm not able to react in time. I'm no A player, that's for sure, but still... Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks, Larry .........................

Subject: Re: Another Serve Question Date: 22 Jun 2000 17:42:41 GMT From: "Garry Carter" Larry, Jordan's answer is right on. I have just copied an answer I gave to another question but it doesn't ad much to his response. The Rule is 3.9(h) and reads essentially: Screen Serve. A served ball that first hits the front wall and on the rebound passes so closely to the server, or server's partner in doubles, that it prevents the receiver from having a clear view of the ball. (The receiver is obligated to take up good court position, near center court, to obtain that view.) You will note that no specific distance is mentioned. The two elements necessary are that the receiver is prevented from having a clear view of the ball but this obstruction MUST come from the ball passing "so closely to the server". As a referee you must determine in your own mind what "so closely" means. I have in the past discussed this rule and used the 18" as an example since it was apparently once used and so many players mention it. Basically my logic is that if the server doesn't break the drive serve line (3' from the wall) and the ball rebounds to either the wall or the back corner then it is practically impossible geometrically to have the ball pass any closer than 18" to the server. From a full extension of the arm, 3' is about as close as the ball can come to the server. For this reason, I will normally not award a screen in either of these cases. I like to emphasize that the referee should be careful not to make the screen call so quickly that it takes away a good offensive opportunity. This is covered in Rule 3.14(a)(4) but also applies to the serve. This is why it is best to brief the players that you, as the referee, will not call screens immediately and that they should signal with their free arm that they believe they have been screened but should continue play. You will then stop play immediately if you believe the criteria for a screen has been met. Please excuse the extra content to this reply but this is an area of the game that many refs are not comfortable with. I hope this helps. Later, Garry -- Garry Carter California Rules Commissioner


Subject: Re: screen serve question Date: Sun, 03 Sep 2000 00:03:13 GMT From: "Otto Dietrich" Hi Garry Your comments were basically correct, although I do have a comment about one of them. You stated, in part: > If all three elements are present, it's a screen... but a ref should not > stop play or call a "Screen" unless the receiver indicates that he wants > the screen called. [Rule 3.14(a)(4)] The last part of that sentence is incorrrect! It might be a typo on you part, The referee not only CAN, but also SHOULD, call a screen serve if he detects BOTH closeness and impairment caused by the closeness--even if the player does NOT indicate that he wants a screen called! That's one of those real tough judgements calls that good ref's need to make. This is something that I go over with the players BEFORE the match begins--how I will judge a screen and that I will call one if I consider the ball as passing close and detect any hesitiation of the receiver's part which I think was caused by that closeness. Of couse, I also consider putting one's hand up on a close serve as being an indication of impairment too. Just thought I'd better point that out so as not to give the wrong impression about how to make screen call! Otto OTTO E. DIETRICH President, United States Racquetball Association 1998-Present National Rules Commissioner 1988-1998 Member of National Rules Committee 1982-Present Subject: Re: screen serve question Date: Sun, 03 Sep 2000 00:03:13 GMT From: "Otto Dietrich" Hi Garry Your comments were basically correct, although I do have a comment about one of them. You stated, in part: > If all three elements are present, it's a screen... but a ref should not > stop play or call a "Screen" unless the receiver indicates that he wants > the screen called. [Rule 3.14(a)(4)] The last part of that sentence is incorrrect! It might be a typo on you part, The referee not only CAN, but also SHOULD, call a screen serve if he detects BOTH closeness and impairment caused by the closeness--even if the player does NOT indicate that he wants a screen called! That's one of those real tough judgements calls that good ref's need to make. This is something that I go over with the players BEFORE the match begins--how I will judge a screen and that I will call one if I consider the ball as passing close and detect any hesitiation of the receiver's part which I think was caused by that closeness. Of couse, I also consider putting one's hand up on a close serve as being an indication of impairment too. Just thought I'd better point that out so as not to give the wrong impression about how to make screen call! Otto OTTO E. DIETRICH President, United States Racquetball Association 1998-Present National Rules Commissioner 1988-1998 Member of National Rules Committee 1982-Present
Subject: Re: Service question?? Date: 04 Sep 2000 07:13:39 GMT From: (Jordan Kahn) You are correct. The Official Rule for serves ONLY allows the server to hide the service motion, contact of ball with racquet and contact of ball with front wall. The Official Rule does say that the "receiver" must have a "clear view" of the ball ONLY as it PASSES the server from the REBOUND off the front wall. (Rule 3.9 h). This only applies if the receiver takes court position "near" the center of the court and also applies for the server's partner- if playing doubles. It is VERY GOOD strategy to "hide" all your serves as much as possible, even if this means starting or ending your serve to "block" the receivers view of "how", "when" and "where" the serve hits the front wall. Good luck, Jordan -- Here is the question: Does the receiver have the right to see the ball leave the racquet and hit the front wall on the serve. The way I read the rules, I say no. Only on the rebound, provided he, or she, has "good" court postion. Thanks in advance. Randy <><